Schumer and Clinton are just not getting it. This article starts off a bit confusing but does have some decent points on the misinformation that is being put out about the National Tracing Center database.
In another article, Senator Schumer claims the NRA has undue influence on the gun control debate because it is - “among the biggest givers in Congress.
Both New York senators voted against tort reform that would stop lawsuits seeking to hold firearms manufacturers responsible for their legally-sold, properly-functioning products.
Senator Schumer received campaign contributions of $2,363,373 from lawyers during the 2004 election cycle, more than double the $1,151,130 the NRA contributed to all federal candidates and parties. Likewise, Senator Clinton received $2,891,672 from lawyers during the same period.
By Senator Schumer'’s criteria, lawyers have an exponentially greater undue influence on the New York senators'’ abilities to pass laws that benefit the people.The real crisis here is law firms buying influence to maintain a legal environment where frivolous lawsuits flourish, which in turn transfers more money and power to a small group of trial lawyers. The rest of us end up paying in increased costs of goods and services. The Senators'’ true goal is to know where every "gun was first sold."” To do this, they must keep a permanent record the original purchase:
For instance, if police report a stolen gun used in a crime in New York to the ATF, local law enforcement could learn where that gun was first sold…...
I cut out the links in the quote since they were all wrong or broken. You can get the links in the article endnotes should you be interested. I apologize if the formatting has been buggered a bit.
I love the bit about lawyer's contributions. Like the mainstream gun control groups, they love to vilify the NRA contributions, but shovel in contributions from other sources and vote to support their agenda. Nothing like a touch of hypocrisy to define your political career.
The NYPost piece by Chuckles and Hillary can be found here.
This bit gets me in the complete failure of logic.
As for the 'sources of "gun crimes"' last I saw those were people. Guns are still inanimate objects last I saw. They don't have the ability to jump up and commit a crime on their own.
As to tracking where the gun was first sold, I think there is a problem with that logic as well. It makes the leap of logic that the original sale was illegal. What does the database show you related to gun dealers that sell in areas of high crime rates. If guns are stolen frequently in a certain area, then the dealer will appear to have a link to the gun crimes, though they may likely never sell a gun illegally. I don't see any problem with compiling such data and allowing the ATF to investigate more suspicious sellers, but this is not going to stop "gun crime."
The worst contention of the NY Gun-grabbing Duo is here:
The other problem with that statement relates to the number of out of state guns coming into NY. There seems to be an implication that these guns are brought in by outside entities. I don't know if that is intended, but that's what it sounds like to me.
I'll agree that all state and local police agencies should report into the standing ATF database, but I won't come to the logic that it will provide any useful data without a serious amount of investigation after trends are found. I also find no logic to the idea that the database would or could provide for preemption for gun crimes.
Chuckles and Hillary just don't make any case. No facts, no arguments. No logic.
The NYPost piece by Chuckles and Hillary can be found here.
This bit gets me in the complete failure of logic.
The National Tracing Center database is an essential resource for law enforcement. Beyond enabling law enforcement to trace the history of a gun linked to a crime, it helps identify patterns of gun theft and trafficking. And that information can help local law enforcement -— like the NYPD -— in stopping illegal guns before they're used to commit crimes.I am still baffled at how the database could be used to preemptively stop crime. If a gun is stolen it's not likely to be in the hands of a law abiding citizen. A law abiding citizen has enough difficulty carrying a gun for protection these days, especially in NY. So how does the gun's information get compared to the data in the database? The gun's not like a car, no license plate to call in to see if it's stolen. Not to mention, being concealed, the police can't see the serial number. Are the criminals in NY stupider than elsewhere? I doubt they openly carry their illegal weapons so the NYPD can check the serial numbers.
For instance, if police report a stolen gun used in a crime in New York to the ATF, local law enforcement could learn where that gun was first sold, and whether other guns sold by the same dealer were used in other crimes in other states. This helps law enforcement identify sources of "crime guns" so that they can cut the supply off at the source.
As for the 'sources of "gun crimes"' last I saw those were people. Guns are still inanimate objects last I saw. They don't have the ability to jump up and commit a crime on their own.
As to tracking where the gun was first sold, I think there is a problem with that logic as well. It makes the leap of logic that the original sale was illegal. What does the database show you related to gun dealers that sell in areas of high crime rates. If guns are stolen frequently in a certain area, then the dealer will appear to have a link to the gun crimes, though they may likely never sell a gun illegally. I don't see any problem with compiling such data and allowing the ATF to investigate more suspicious sellers, but this is not going to stop "gun crime."
The worst contention of the NY Gun-grabbing Duo is here:
From 1988 to 2003, 92 percent of the illegal handguns recovered in New York City came from out of state. Stopping the flow of illegal guns into the Empire State is essential to ending the gun violence on our streets. We are therefore pressing our colleagues in both the Senate and the House to repeal the senseless law that handcuffs law enforcement and the public from having full access to the ATF gun-tracing database.Why would the public need access to this database? What good would that do? I could see some reasoning to let FFL holders have access to the database to ensure that the gun isn't illegal. But that also poses the question about crime guns sold by police departments to raise funding. How would those guns be tracked? What happens if one of those crime guns doesn't get properly cleared in the database?
The other problem with that statement relates to the number of out of state guns coming into NY. There seems to be an implication that these guns are brought in by outside entities. I don't know if that is intended, but that's what it sounds like to me.
I'll agree that all state and local police agencies should report into the standing ATF database, but I won't come to the logic that it will provide any useful data without a serious amount of investigation after trends are found. I also find no logic to the idea that the database would or could provide for preemption for gun crimes.
Chuckles and Hillary just don't make any case. No facts, no arguments. No logic.
1 comment:
Oh come on, the main reason they want to keep the records is so they can start the confiscation. With Canada as a perfect template, they only register some guns, then confiscate those. Then they register more, no plans for confiscation until they actually do. I wish it was a paranoid fantasy, but it just isn't.
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